| Author |
 Topic  |
|
|
warthog5
Head Shark
12309 Posts |
 Posted - 10/25/2004 : 12:43:36
|
I've just spent a considerable amount of time reserching a new compressor for my shop. I've been thinking about this for 1 1/2yrs, but I just started my reserch.
Here's some things that I found if your thinking about buying one.
1st Bigger is better. It's better because your not limited down the road when you want to buy say a blast cabinet. They consume a LOT of air.
Had you bought the smaller compressor and then deside on a blast cabinet. 2 things will happen. 1st you will be waiting around a long time for the air to catch up and blasting a short time. This makes the project take forever of blasting a part. Or you will be buying another compressor that is a bigger size. "Money Wasted"!
My original compressor is a Black Max Sanborn. I got it from Sam's Club for around $400. It's a 60gal tank and single stage. Max preasure is 135PSI.
It has given me good service for 12yrs, but it's real tired now. Having accumilated lot's of air tools over the years, I use it a lot.
let's start with looking at the CFM of a compressor. Or better yet the advertised CFM. Now everyone should know what CFM is, but do you know what ACFM is? Then there is SCFM as a rating. After scratching my head and reading for another 6 to 8hrs I found this.
** This is Actual Cubic Feet per Minute air flow at 100 psi. Be aware some manufacturers list SCFM or
"Free Air" CFM at pressure, which is not a true representation of actual air flow at pressure.
Now the only compressor's I found that listed this was a Belair compressor.
So what they are saying is at the very extreme you MAY get XYZ CFM.
But if it is listed as ACFM. It has been tested and is a true output.
Case in point of the compressor I picked. Belair model #218V.
CFM is 18.59 ACFM @ 100PSI = 15.33 ACFM @ 175PSI = 13.75
So you can see a pretty fair persentage drop there.
Now the Box store compressor's are listed as CFM or SCFM. This leads you to belive that they will put those volume's out and it's just not so. No one has a way to even test the CFM output at home. It run's your air tool or it doesn't.
Now I found another thing wrong with HP ratings. Everyone has seen the HP rating stickers put on tool's. Like my Craftsman Shop Vac. 6.5HP.[88] NO WAY.
I found a class action Law suite aginst the companies that are mostly sold at the box store's. Campbell Hausfeld builds compressor's and label's them with diffrent names. The suite is over the HP ratings on these compressor's. The bottom line on this suite is the consumer lost!
They got $50 and the lawer's won. No telling how much they got.
http://www.aircompressorsettlement.com/notice.pdf
I actuall ordered a Ingersoll-Rand as I alway's held them in high quality. I then did more reserch and cancelled the order.
http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/Displayitem.taf?itemnumber=44675
Look at the price of the Ingersoll-Rand. $849.99
Now look at this compressor for $899.00
http://www.menintools.com/compressor/ba218v.html
Here is the spec sheet from Belair.
http://www.industrial-air-compressors.com/specsheet.html
It's a no Brainer[:x)] |
Pensacola,FL
 |
Edited by - warthog5 on 10/25/2004 12:47:47 |
|
|
Stauter99
Member
186 Posts |
Posted - 10/25/2004 : 17:51:10
|
| Hey Warthog. Im new at the air compressor game, but what would be a good air compressor to used primarily to spray paint that is not too expensive? What are the requirements? I know nothing about them but want one for Christmas. Thanks. |
Sonny
1962 16' Boston Whaler Nauset
"If peope concentrated on the important things in life there would be a severe shortage of fishing poles."
Mobile, Alabama |
 |
|
|
warthog5
Head Shark
12309 Posts |
Posted - 10/25/2004 : 18:55:54
|
QUOTE: used primarily to spray paint that is not too expensive.
Well a 60gal single stage will give you good service for that. You should be able to find one at the box stores for around $450. Years ago we used to buy those 30gal Sears units and they were barely enough. We'd run them to death.
Here's one for $429.
http://www.lowes.com/lkn?action=productDetail&productId=18499-1126-VT6329
You will need a dedacated 20amp curcuit and it will draw 15amps. |
Pensacola,FL
|
Edited by - warthog5 on 10/25/2004 18:59:13 |
|
|
|
Stauter99
Member
186 Posts |
Posted - 10/25/2004 : 19:11:15
|
| Thanks Bobby. Is there a minimum CFM or PSI I need to know about? Thanks!! |
Sonny
1962 16' Boston Whaler Nauset
"If peope concentrated on the important things in life there would be a severe shortage of fishing poles."
Mobile, Alabama |
|
|
|
warthog5
Head Shark
12309 Posts |
Posted - 10/25/2004 : 19:39:04
|
| Sonny I'm not going to preach CFM to you on this one. The compressor I pointed out to you will be taxed a little running a DA sander. I have run a sandblaster off of the one I have now and it's very similar to the one I pointed out to you. Sandblasting will tax the Hell out of it. Painting a car or boat it will work fine. Running air impact guns, it will work fine. Does that help. |
Pensacola,FL
|
|
|
|
Stauter99
Member
186 Posts |
Posted - 10/25/2004 : 19:48:03
|
That helps alot. I just want one that I can Paitn with and maybe later on run some tools on. It seems like something handy to have. How about a nail gun? |
Sonny
1962 16' Boston Whaler Nauset
"If peope concentrated on the important things in life there would be a severe shortage of fishing poles."
Mobile, Alabama |
|
|
|
warthog5
Head Shark
12309 Posts |
Posted - 10/25/2004 : 20:00:02
|
| Nail guns are real easy on consuming air. Not a problem. |
Pensacola,FL
|
|
|
|
RingLeader
Ace
USA
6173 Posts |
Posted - 10/25/2004 : 21:45:00
|
The 60 gallon single stage I vought this year is the bare minumum for running a DA sander as well as impact wrenches and whatnot. For painting, its perfect.
I have a 20 or 30 gallon (not sure), but its not really god for anything except a nail gun, airing up tires, and very light painting. I was painting some molding for the house the other day with it... It ran constantly. It could just keep up and thats it. Thats how my big compressor runs with my DA sander. If I had to to it again, I would have bought the dual stage.
As for the machine Bobby is getting, its top notch commercial grade for sure. When I wear this one out, I'll get one like that. |
Slidell, LA
1985 Mako 21B - RingLeader
1993 Mako 261B - Temperance
 |
|
|
|
warthog5
Head Shark
12309 Posts |
Posted - 10/25/2004 : 21:56:56
|
That's how these things progress. In the '70's & '80's we used the 2hp 30gal Sears. I never had one. I learned that I wanted one bigger. So I got a single stage 60gal 5hp. 12yrs latter that one is worn out and we move to a commersiel grade 2 stage 80gal unit. This one should last me. |
Pensacola,FL
|
|
|
|
mubikS
Member
USA
2437 Posts |
Posted - 10/27/2004 : 08:15:48
|
Dad picked up the Campbell from Harbor Freight: http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/Displayitem.taf?itemnumber=47065 .
He painted my motorcycle, and I did my entire boat with it. It would kick on once per cup of paint (little under a pint or so)... basically, I would run out of paint before I could run it out of air. I don't know about air tools, but you can't beat the price. |
'72 Mako 17, Suzuki 140
'74 Mako 19B Project FOR SALE
Seabird 21 Project
Helms 25 sailboat
Wake, VA
  |
|
|
|
warthog5
Head Shark
12309 Posts |
Posted - 10/27/2004 : 12:25:33
|
Tools that consume a lot of air.
Sandblasting
DA [dual action] sander
Inline sander [airfile] |
Pensacola,FL
|
|
|
|
DestinBound
Member
USA
1011 Posts |
Posted - 10/28/2004 : 21:09:40
|
Most of the time they list PEAK HP, which has nothing to do with actual running HP. This is normally the HP developed when the motor starts. Starting an electric motor causes a huge momentary current draw - not long enough to pop your breaker.
So, you can figure out if the HP rating of an electric motor is possible or not here is the basic formula:
1HP = 746 watts
HP = (Volts x Current x Efficency)/746watts
So for a 230V 15A circuit @ 100% efficiency (which isn't real) you have:
(230x15x1)/746=4.62HP
So in reality your motor will be generating somewhat less than 5HP.
Two stage compressors are nice since you store a lot more air in the same volume at the higher pressure. If you are going to use the compressor alot stay away from oil less ones. Their durability is questionable in my mind.
This one from Sears would work for occasional use:
Craftsman Professional 25 gal. Air Compressor, 3-1/2 hp, Vertical Tank, 2-Stage Oil Free Pump
Sears item #00916778000 Mfr. model #16778
This portable model has a 2-stage patented oil free pump which is the highest pressure capability on 120v models. 175 max psi cut-in at 140 psi means more useable air in a smaller tank.
|
  
***
'66 Correct Craft Mustang
'80 236IB - In Jacksons Gap, AL
'03 Pursuit 2670 in Destin, FL |
|
|
|
michigan dave
Head Shark
USA
5731 Posts |
Posted - 10/31/2004 : 17:48:12
|
| Heres my idea on air compressers, keep an eye out for a full service gas station that is switching over to convenience store. You can buy all kinds of cool tools cheep if you are at the right place at the right time. I have 2-5horse industrials running in tandom and have less than 500 in the pair. These are older cast iron 2 stage machines. Just dont get a 3 phase unit unless your willing to change the motor,. we have run 3 da's at once and they will keep up. better than the days when I "sand awile,wait awile" |
1979m21 225johnson "blue dolphin" bought off this board and restored
with everyones help!!Gone but not Forgotten....
1979 20 Mako 115 Suzuki gone
1977 19 Mako 115 Johnson gone
1976 23 Mako twin 140 Johnsons gone
1983 224 with closed transom and bracket
S.Haven MI>Columbus OH |
|
|
|
warthog5
Head Shark
12309 Posts |
Posted - 10/31/2004 : 18:29:58
|
That's a good idea Dave. |
Pensacola,FL
|
|
|
|
warthog5
Head Shark
12309 Posts |
Posted - 11/05/2004 : 10:53:04
|
It's Here.
 |
Pensacola,FL
|
|
|
|
Gary Shallbetter
Member
USA
1615 Posts |
Posted - 11/09/2004 : 19:27:11
|
Thanks Warthog,
For once somebody has explained this so Joe regular guy can understand this. I think you should write a book called "Mako Repair for Dumbies". Ill buy one. G |
|
|
|
warthog5
Head Shark
12309 Posts |
Posted - 11/22/2004 : 16:09:27
|
Here it is installed. i added an hour meter to keep track of maintance.
 |
Pensacola,FL
|
|
|
|
RingLeader
Ace
USA
6173 Posts |
Posted - 11/22/2004 : 17:17:29
|
| I dragged my compressor over to the new house last night. It won't be hooked up for a while, but its there! Too much other shit to do first. |
Slidell, LA
1985 Mako 21B - RingLeader
1993 Mako 261B - Temperance
|
|
|
|
warthog5
Head Shark
12309 Posts |
Posted - 11/22/2004 : 20:00:14
|
| I just installed a auto timmer on the drain tonight. It has a adjustable timer that plugs into a 110V outlet. I'm going to change that and wire it to one leg of the 220V. That way it's only powered up when the compressor is turned on. |
Pensacola,FL
|
|
|
|
Warbird
New Member
USA
3 Posts |
Posted - 03/09/2005 : 13:45:34
|
Warthog, thank you for this information. I would like your (and others) opinions on the Campbell - Hausfeld VT6329 that you linked to at Lowe's for another person.
My situation: I live in Fairbanks, Alaska and shipping heavy items (like compressors!) up here, ain't cheap. I am converting my detached 900 sq ft garage into a hobbiest automotive shop and I am looking for a good compressor. As it happens, the new Lowe's store they just built up here has this compressor for $437.00.
My requirements: I'll be running impact wrenches, air ratchets, paint sprayers, grease guns, etc. Basically, the whole gambit of automotive pneumatic tools. I do not plan on ever running a sander. I might, someday, like to get one of those sandblaster enclosures.
My questions: Is this a good price for what you are getting? In your opinion, will it run all my automotive pneumatic tools just fine, without the compressor running the entire time I'm working? If I do get a sandblasting enclosure, will this compressor handle it, even if it has to run constantly to keep up?
Thank you again. Your opinions and knowledge are much appreciated.
-James / Warbird |
 |
|
|
|
warthog5
Head Shark
12309 Posts |
Posted - 03/09/2005 : 14:18:02
|
You will really be taxing it running a sandblast cabinet. A bunch of those blast cabinets are fairly small, so your not going to be doing big parts. It will work, but may be slow going.
As to the other tool's, you will be fine. |
Pensacola,FL
|
|
|
|
Warbird
New Member
USA
3 Posts |
Posted - 03/09/2005 : 15:22:50
|
Okay. That is about what I'd figured. One of my buddies is selling a used compressor, so I'm going to check that one out. He wants $450 for it and I don't have the brand name or the stats on it yet, other than it has a 60 gallon tank. If it ends up being dual stage, I'll most likely get it. Otherwise, I'll buy the one at Lowe's.
Thanks again for all the info in this thread! I'll post some pics of my shop as it is coming together.
ps. What do you mainly use your compressor for? The one you got is quite nice.  |
|
|
|
|
warthog5
Head Shark
12309 Posts |
Posted - 03/09/2005 : 20:19:33
|
Running everything in my shop.
And the new addition with the new roof on the shop.
 |
Pensacola,FL
|
|
|
|
Warbird
New Member
USA
3 Posts |
Posted - 03/10/2005 : 12:06:25
|
Sweet!! I like the addition to cover the boat. Very nice.
So I looked at my buddy's compressor that he's selling and I'm having a very difficult time finding some "hard numbers" on it. It is a "Charge Air Pro" that was made by Ingersoll-Rand. I wrote down the model number as "IR5E6VA" but I'm pretty certain I missed a "0" and the actual number is "IR5E60VA".
The ONLY site I could find with anything specifically for a "Charge Air" compressor is http://www.devilbissparts.com. As far as I can tell, his compressor is a 5 HP (yes, I know all about the HP ratings), 60 gal, compressor with the following CFM ratings listed on the tank, 12.5 CFM @ 40 PSI and 11.0 CFM @ 90 PSI. Oh, and it is definitely single stage.
So... here's my problem... my buddy thinks that this compressor of his is "the shiznit". He wants $450 for it. It is used, he got it at an auction, and doesn't remember who owned it previously. From my point of view, the compressor looks in decent shape. The cage around the belt/pulley on the motor is missing and the pulley itself has some rust I'd need to clean off. I turned the flywheel on the pump by hand and verified it does work. However, I have absolutely no idea how many hours are on this thing. I don't know if it was well taken care of, and it has been sitting in a covered area outside. Basically, it's been kept dry but it has been exposed to extreme cold (at least -50 F, maybe colder).
Sorry for the long shpeel to get to my question but here it is:
What is so hot about my buddy's compressor, other than it has the "Ingersoll-Rand" name on it? Would I be a fool to let that one go and buy the one at Lowe's instead, for $437?? I mean, brand spankin' new for CHEAPER than this used one. My buddy isn't pressing me to buy his or anything. It's just that he seems so confident about that compressor of his, I want to make sure I'm not missing something.
TIA,
-James / Warbird |
|
Edited by - Warbird on 03/10/2005 12:09:17 |
|
|
| |
Topic |
|
Buying a new Air Compressor
